sampa : colin’s blog

Here in Norway it has been banned to smoke in public areas offices and so on for years, unless for special designated areas. But last summer the non-smoking law was extended to:

# Smoking isn’t allowed where food and/or drink are served.
# Bars and restaurants won’t be allowed to create special rooms for smokers.
# Smoking will be allowed in outdoor cafes, as long as the smoke doesn’t filter in to the cafe’s indoor area.
# Owners of eating and drinking establishments must enforce the smoking ban.
# Smoking rooms will be allowed for employees, as long as similar rest areas for non-smokers have at least as high a standard.

I know Sweden also got a similar law this month.

Welcome to a smoke free environment here in Norway, Colin

André

Hmmm indeed. You’re mixing a few different things here, only some of which fit under the banner of ‘civilized’:
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=civilized
There’s no question to me that some of the peoples of Europe are more “inward looking, dour, pessimistic” than some of the peoples of other regions. But this generally has no bearing on whether the society would qualify as civilized or not.

To me the definition of a civilized society is one in which a large group of people can live together in an efficient, low-crime, low-corruption, educated, and cultured fashion, and there is general buy-in by the people of the importance of these aspects. As to the rudeness aspect, that _is_ a mark of civility, but that’s a big mix all over the world, and you have to consider the man on the street vs. people you deal with in stores and institutions.

As I mentioned, I was born in Romania, which is certainly the most ‘latin’ country in the old Eastern Bloc. I’ve certainly travelled a decent amount to Latin America and the poor countries of S-E Asia. I _love_ the atmosphere and generally more fiery or passionate temperament of the people in these places; to some extent it’s in my blood. At the same time, I’m not sure you can really call many of these countries civilized. Nice places to visit, or even live there if you have the money, but not great places (due to corruption, crime, pollution, education level, and many other reasons) to raise a family and grow a business.

As for North America, Australia, and devleoped Asia, well, they certainly are civilized; here it’s more a matter of where the society places the emphasis, and how each individual sees that. There’s no question that western European states and the general population there place more emphasis on public transit, education, and culture, among other things, than we do in North America. In saying I always thought of Europe as being slightly more civilized, I was making a comment that reflected on what I think is important, and I’m sure others may not agree; this is a very subjective thing. And you’re not going to see me moving to Europe right now because of this either, , there’re a number of other things to consider beside the fact that you consier one place ’slightly’ more civilized than another…

Colin

I am also a Canadian (ex-smoker) (and Winnipeg, not T.O.), and things have definitely changed in Canada.
I remember hearing stories from parents about going into the doctors office, late 60’s,
70’s etc.. and the Doctor would be smoking in the doctors office!!!
Its actually come to the point where it is seen as a form of abuse (i.e. child abuse)
You see the commercials on T.V. about it here, etc..
I do remember it as being very well acceptted in Europe (France, I especially remember)

Anyway, its not good for you.. its not good for others…. (however I still miss it once in awhile)
Basically, if it were as healthy as a glass of milk and it didnt hurt anyone.. I’d be going to
the store for a pack of Marlboros right now.

Cheers

I don’t agree with the non-smokeing laws and stuff.
If you don’t like the smoke, then go somewhere else, but only because it isn’t healty you make us hide, and place us in “smoker areas”, we smokers have the same rights as you, what makes you more special to be able to stay in a coffe shop and i have to leave ?!?! if the coffe shop has a big sign posted with no smoking then i won’t go there, but DON’T try to impose those rules in each coffe show.

I think we all know it isn’t healty… i know i might get cancer, and i know that my health is going downwards… but i like it so why do you make this discrimination ?!
it is a discrimination no, smokers are now hunted down by “ackward” laws. Can i hunt people with a bad parfume, or a bad hygen… can i ask them to leave the room because they make me unconfortable

Paul,

A bad parfume, or a bad hygen will hardly kill your neighbors but your bad cigarette smoke can !

Actually, being a passive smoker means you have no choice - passive is the process of being subjected to something. If we had the choice then you would not hear any complaints.

Smoking and AIDS are not equal comparisons. One is a choice that is continually made, the other is a disease which provides no choices. If a sufferer of AIDS walked around with a needle full of their blood, and started injecting people, then yes, they would (and should) be put on the equivalent of an ‘island’ (e.g segregated in a prison).

At the end of the day, the choice of a smoker to smoke has a detrimental effect on everyone - it is killing both the smoker and the passive smoker. Non-smoking laws do not harm anyone, other than the indignation of the smoker. In my opinion it’s a no-brainer - the rights of people to lead their life without being subjected to a toxic substance far outweigh the freedom of the smoker to smoke anywhere.

hey, guys! And what about the smell, smoke etc. produced by any factory in it’s neighborhood you probably live? Do you have a choice? I don’t think so… IMHO it’s more bad for you than cigarette smoke can even be…

Greetings from Czech Republic…

(I am a smoker but I try my best to be considerate…

Yesterday, or i think it was the day before yesterday some software development company (sounds so important if i say it this way, but what the heck…) introduced something called “smoking breaks”… that means you are allowed to have 3 such things / day. Quess what happened ? Three senior developers resigned, muhahaha take that you ignorant bastards (i’m talking to their bosses )